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Info on the gator permit screw up.

Cajun

Well-known member
Heres an email I got back from Harry Dutton FWC coordinator alligator management program. Now we even have his 2 way nextel # . Later Cajun


Dear Mr. Towns:

In the past two years, the demand for permits was well below the number available. In fact, about one third of the permits available (more than 1,200 permits) were left on the table. The changes this year were developed to maximize the number of permits issued and better utilize established harvest quotas. These changes also responded to comments and requests from stakeholders who requested the ability to purchase additional permits. These changes were structured to issue permits on a first-come, first-served basis where a person could purchase an alligator trapping license and an initial permit (with two tags) and then go back into the system to purchase an additional
permit(s) (2 tags per permit).

As you are well aware of, we encountered some serious problems with the computer-based permit application and issuance process. The system went down for about 1 hour (from about 10:20am until about 11:40am) and this frustrated a lot of applicants. Our permits and licenses are issued by a contracted private vendor. The computer system glitches have been identified by the license vendor and fixes have been applied to prevent this problem from happening next year. Staff will also be evaluating permit sales to determine if any additional constraints on sales are necessary to ensure equal opportunities to those who are interested in participating.


It was unfortunate that some people were unable to get permits and others didn’t get the harvest areas they wanted. We regret that there are unsatisfied customers and we offer our apologies for the permit issuance problems. We sincerely promise that we will do our best to make sure the process goes smoothly next year. This likely will include a scheduled delay in the sale of additional permits until we believe folks have had adequate time to purchase a permit. Please don't hesitate to contact me directly if you have any further ideas or comments.



Best Regards,



Harry J. Dutton, Coordinator
Alligator Management Program
Division of Hunting and Game Management
FL Fish and Wildlife Conservation Commission
620 S. Meridian Street
Tallahassee, FL 32399-1600
(850) 410-0656 ext. 17279
(850) 921-7793 FAX
Nextel: (850) 528-0653
Direct Connect: 195*124*18317
 
Fair enough response. Seems they or he has taken the problem to heart and found it was a real problem, and worked a solution.

I especially like his invitation to contact him.

Good show !

Scotty
 
I had some dealings there 2-3 years ago and was treated pretty respectably. I just got off the phone with him again and was assured that this was gonna have some positive changes now that there has been shown there is plenty of interest. I hope that this gets the attention it needs. I've had emails sent to him from all over the country, from every orginization I belong to, and all the forums. I had Halibut harpooners out of Alaska to squirrel hunters from Ala. and Miss. and all in between, especially from La. my home state emailing him. So maybe next year will be different. We wiil see. Later
 
If The FWC was a private business alot of folks would have and should have lost their jobs over this! Blaming the private vender is the only thing they can do to save face! Great job cajun, Ya'll know how I feel about this whole mess. I would still keep a close eye on some folks who seem to be real close with the FWC or in a position to be. Still beleive there were some inside info devulged to certain people in the right positions. I saw what was going on that day with the program and it was not Elvis and some aliens by no means :D
 
Well I am getting too old or lazy or both, cause I didn't even put in for it. Maybe the 3 back surgerys has something to do with it. Anyway in the perfect world, i would have loved to seen every private partie get something and the guides get enough to support their families if this is their livelyhood. Maybe, just maybe they will find something closer to a happy medium. All we can do is show concern thru emails and calls to try to structure it in a way that will allow more folks the chance of getting theirs next time. Later, Cajun
 
Often info is posted on this site as he said/she and so&so thought, ect & it looks like a dog chasing it's tail. I've been involved with the gator program for decades, have influenced the program & I'm fairly free with the info, especially with my clients & customers. I've probably posted more on SA than I should have so now I guess I need to get busy & produce the Ratworks Equipment that's needed by all to kill gators & then go kill what I have to.Happy hunting


Gatorstick wrote this and I believe he is part of the FAA, which is made up of businesses. Not picking a fight but I do feel that there should be a more professional attitude coming from a person in your position.
 
It made me POed and not just a little. but a lot. I just would liked to been able to get 1 just 1 permit. I don't even wont 2 tags I just would like to get 1.


But some folks has to work for a livin,and not in front of a computer all day. So by the time I got off work and got to the tag office there was none left.
 
Bla bla bla bla bla..........I guess next year i'll take that day off. Or I'll have 10k of our chinese employees log on for me. Better yet, those indian people do well on the phone service thing. Bet I can find a phone service to tie up all the lines and buy me all the permits I want. Where there's a will there's a way right..........you commercial guys enjoy it this year, it will be the last free for all you get.
 
Nice work there Cajun.
I see your trying to make things better, for everybody.
Including the average airboater.

Seems like the happy hunter shoulda been trying to do something like that for the general airboating public who'd like to get a gator.

Guess he got what he wanted, and Joe airboater's just SOL.
HIGH OFFICE, AND HIGH HORSES HAVE THIER PRIVELEDGES.
Thats cool, but don't fling it in peoples faces.

Happy Hunting.
 
There are other avenues legally that can challenge the past events. I encourage everyone to read the florida statutes on incorporations and not for profit incorportations and pay particular interest to the sections that address personal conflict. It appears that there are some statutes that deal with financial gain issues. I'm just a serf...pig...oppressed individual that is exploring all legal avenues. I'm just average joe airboater but I do recognize why our reserve troops are on active duty right now. Maybe I think outside the box but what the hell, that's what I'm paid to do.
 
10k of our chinese employees log on for me.

Great idea!! What will they work for? That would definately bring in a few permits.

The AMU has very good folks there that offer some of the best service of any of the state's agencies. The mistakes that were made this year will not be repeated.

Speaking of suits, if anyone wants to sue, why not sue Manatee County over their ridiculous airboat restrictions. We could sure use a sacrificial county out there.
 
I wasn't talking about suits. I mention legal avenues IF and only IF there was wrongdoing. A lawsuit wouldn't have anything to do with it. An investigation by state authorities is what I could see happening if things were done in a shady manner. I can't say how things went down as I'm not interested in gator hunts. There are, however, many individuals that feel something isn't right. An investigation will clear the air or right the wrong.

On a side note....10,000 chinese is better than a sweatshop full of minors.
 
Contrary to the theories, here is what we have with the gator issue:

1) Bad judgement on a single procedure on FWC-AMU part, that being the multi permits from the get go. All other changes to the program were very good & long overdue. Overall the AMU does a great job and should not be happered for a single misjudgement. They won't repeat that mistake.

2) Major screw up on the part of the vendor, Total Licensing Systems (I beleive ther'e in Ohio) and ya'll know what problems they had. They may lose their contract or be heavily fined/penalized.

The Commissioners are well aware of the situation and it will not repeat itself.
 
10,000 Chinese should be able to grab most of the permits, if not all. For $5 to get on the comuter is worth the time. Are Mexicans computer literate?
You got me thinking............
 
Gatorstick, what if ..... and this is purely conjecture. What If a few hundred Chinese decided to log on and take all of Florida's permits. Not that they intended to use them, but what if they did ?? What then?

I posted earlier in this thread that I felt that issuing something like this on line was risky because it didn't allow a level playing field. I had't even considered the possibility of some outside intervention.
 
A big sincere THANK YOU TO CAJUN, I would suggest a few hundred more emails to the FWC just so they really understand how bad it was and maybe ebven suggest a re-draw this year and cancel out all the ones just issued. just a thought, a rather passive one for me LOL ya'll have fun , coming soon a much more subdued me LOL
 
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