how d i tell the difference from a 470 gpu. and a 220 gpu ?

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gator123
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how d i tell the difference from a 470 gpu. and a 220 gpu ?

Post by gator123 »

i recently bought my first aircraft powered boat, and the guy i got it from said it was a o-470 gpu. but i keep hearing people say its a 220. some people say it's a 470 and others say 220 it's really starting to confuse me. i have some ser.#'s that are on the motor on the block it reads 534770 and on my jug's it reads 531284 ak over the # if anyone can shed some light on this i would appreciate it thanks.
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Re: how d i tell the difference from a 470 gpu. and a 220 gp

Post by jimmy »

a 0-470 or a "470"gpu is just that. or the same as a 220
470 ci and 220 hp
it is the same just different names
also called a PE-150
gator123
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Re: how d i tell the difference from a 470 gpu. and a 220 gp

Post by gator123 »

thanks jimmy thats kinda what i thought.
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Re: how d i tell the difference from a 470 gpu. and a 220 gp

Post by goldhunter_2 »

you could also be hearing people talk about 470 angle value conversion gpu's where it basically has angle valve cylinder to replace the std gpu cylinders
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Gonzo
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Re: how d i tell the difference from a 470 gpu. and a 220 gp

Post by Gonzo »

Most of the early 0-470 AC were dry sumped with four bolt flanges on intake and exhaust in an updraft configuration, dual mag. The PE-150 Packett was in a gen unit used by the military. The intake pipes and manifold are on top of the engine and came with a Zenith sidedraft, wet sump with a thirty pound oil pan, single mag. Yes they are both 470 cubic inches. The PE-150 they say and have heard called a 220, sorry- not quite there. The original set up had low compression dished pistons, and could have had three different cams that I know of. Yes you can take 470 stuff and bolt on, pistons, cyl's, etc. You can have cyl's machined, do mod to front of case and dual mag. Check your screen, keep clean oil in it, enjoy it! Gonzo
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Bruce
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Re: how d i tell the difference from a 470 gpu. and a 220 gp

Post by Bruce »

Gonzo wrote:Most of the early 0-470 AC were dry sumped with four bolt flanges on intake and exhaust in an updraft configuration, dual mag. The PE-150 Packett was in a gen unit used by the military. The intake pipes and manifold are on top of the engine and came with a Zenith sidedraft, wet sump with a thirty pound oil pan, single mag. Yes they are both 470 cubic inches. The PE-150 they say and have heard called a 220, sorry- not quite there. The original set up had low compression dished pistons, and could have had three different cams that I know of. Yes you can take 470 stuff and bolt on, pistons, cyl's, etc. You can have cyl's machined, do mod to front of case and dual mag. Check your screen, keep clean oil in it, enjoy it! Gonzo
the 470 angle valve military motor such as the o470-13 for instance was that way but the early 470 e series had sv cylinders on it two bolt intake and exhaust and was dry and wet sumped they had both as for the 220 its very similar to the e 225 same pistons and similar camshaft so i see no reason why the 220 couldnt be near 220 horse but without a dyno who knows
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Deep Diver
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Re: how d i tell the difference from a 470 gpu. and a 220 gp

Post by Deep Diver »

the manual i have shows the hp curve at 180 hp. probably from the low compression.i don't know where the 220 comes from
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Re: how d i tell the difference from a 470 gpu. and a 220 gp

Post by easyrider »

I have seen good ones run as good or better than most 180-200 rigged compairably and even embarass a 540 from time to time.
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Bruce
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Re: how d i tell the difference from a 470 gpu. and a 220 gp

Post by Bruce »

Deep Diver wrote:the manual i have shows the hp curve at 180 hp. probably from the low compression.i don't know where the 220 comes from
turning it over 2400 is where its supposed to come in theory so ive heard i believe 210 215 tops since they are single magged and have a junk carb however i have seen them gain 100 rpms with a carb swap 100 rpms is a bunch
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easyrider
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Re: how d i tell the difference from a 470 gpu. and a 220 gp

Post by easyrider »

i know a couple ole boys in fellsmere that can make em turn well past that.
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Re: how d i tell the difference from a 470 gpu. and a 220 gp

Post by Gonzo »

Apples and Oranges, the Lad does not appear to know what he has at this time. Yes you can shave cases, put Lycoming rods, port and polish, aftermarket pistons, bore cases and put 520 holes, gapless rings, custom ground cam advanced, on and on and on. I have seen them fly, climb trees, stick rods through the case, throw cylinder heads off. We have seen a lot, Huh!
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Re: how d i tell the difference from a 470 gpu. and a 220 gp

Post by easyrider »

You can spend as much as you want on them but the ones im talking about didn't have any of these things done to them, just saying if you get a good one to start with they ain't a bad motor.
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Re: how d i tell the difference from a 470 gpu. and a 220 gp

Post by Gonzo »

Agree
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Re: how d i tell the difference from a 470 gpu. and a 220 gp

Post by gladstone »

Nothing wrong with the zenith carb if they are built right. Does a automotive engine in a car vibrate as bad as a ground power on a boat? What happens when a car carb starts loading up and dumping fuel? Where does that fuel go? I know on a zenith it goes right out the front of the carb not in the intake. I can fix my zenith if need be right on the boat and in the swamp without worrying about loosing any lil parts. Majority of the time the plunger is what is wrong with a zenith when it acts up. The gpu was in service for 40 yrs and used the same set up. Cars have been arouns for a hundred years so why didnt the military design it with a automotive carb?
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Re: how d i tell the difference from a 470 gpu. and a 220 gp

Post by happy harold »

gladstone; well put.
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Re: how d i tell the difference from a 470 gpu. and a 220 gp

Post by needcoffee »

gladstone wrote:Nothing wrong with the zenith carb if they are built right. Does a automotive engine in a car vibrate as bad as a ground power on a boat? What happens when a car carb starts loading up and dumping fuel? Where does that fuel go? I know on a zenith it goes right out the front of the carb not in the intake. I can fix my zenith if need be right on the boat and in the swamp without worrying about loosing any lil parts. Majority of the time the plunger is what is wrong with a zenith when it acts up. The gpu was in service for 40 yrs and used the same set up. Cars have been arouns for a hundred years so why didnt the military design it with a automotive carb?

They did use a carb from a car. Updraft carbs were used first on cars and tractors starting back in the 1890's. In the 1930's downdraft carbs became more common on vehicles but stayed on aircraft because they don't flood the engine. Your Zenith carb on the GPU is very similar to the Model A Ford Zenith carb.
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Re: how d i tell the difference from a 470 gpu. and a 220 gpu ?

Post by Chifen »

Okay difference between an O 470 GPU and a 220 GPU the 220 GPU was meant for air and it would have a twin mags on it on a 04 70 GPU it was an additional model that they made that had the ground unit it would only have one mag and it would have a downflow header system not an upflow if you have the upflow than you have the under carburetor you have a 220 if you have the over carburetor you have 0470 I have the o-470 downflow for the carburetor on the top I just bought cylinders for it and the only difference I found in the two Motors is the upflow and downflow above carburetor and Below carburetor the above carburetor has o-470 valves in it.

And this past weekend I got to physically hand star prop start my 220-0470 gpu hanging off the back of the cage like a monkey but you know what Old Faithful started up in the first fire off and started up and started going
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Re: how d i tell the difference from a 470 gpu. and a 220 gpu ?

Post by Bamasoflorunner »

If it’s got the oil reservoir on bottom and carb on top it’s a GPU, if it has the oil reservoir on bottom and carb at the front with intake feeding bottom of the cylinders it’s a 470 conversion (520 could if decked etc), if no oil reservoir and updraft carb you have a ac 0470. Enjoy either way.
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