BUZZ BOX?

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RidnDirty
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BUZZ BOX?

Post by RidnDirty »

I recently purchased an 0520 and the guy before ran 93. I recently ran 100LL av gas and it ran like shiat. I had a good friend time the mags manually w/o a buzz box. It runs better but I just bought a buzz box to make sure its optimum. The directions given are below and my questions are in ( ). Just curious cuz I hear you want your mags around 20 - 24 degrees? Wont i adjust until both lights come on.

Directions read:
-Attach black ground lead to any good engine ground.
-Place aircraft ignition switch in the off position. ((I have push button start so I assume its off or do I turn dead man switch off?))
-Attach left red to points of left magneto. ((Where are the points located?))
-Attach right red lead to points of right magneto.
-Turn synchronizer switch on.
-Turn ignition switch on. ((I have push button start, how does that work?))
-Rotate engine slowly watching lights on synchronizer, each light will indicate the exact point opening and closing of its respective magneto. ((Rotate the prop by hand with the mag switchs in off position?))
-Adjust magnetos until both lights are in synchronous and the buzzer changes pitch.
-Turn aircraft ignition switch off.
-Remove synchronizer.

Any tips would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

rbjscott
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Re: BUZZ BOX?

Post by rbjscott »

How do you turn mags on and off on your boat?
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RidnDirty
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Re: BUZZ BOX?

Post by RidnDirty »

Two toggle switches. I have a dead man or battery shut off as well.

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Re: BUZZ BOX?

Post by cntry141iq »

toggles are your igniyion switch .. push button is your starter switch deadman is your battery switch .. a/c mags usually do not need a battery tor fire so if toggles are on and you turn over the engine it may fire .. be careful obviously you are used to cars ... you are on the right track
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rbjscott
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Re: BUZZ BOX?

Post by rbjscott »

If I am turning the prop very much, I pull the top plugs so the engine won't try to start. Just my way of being safe.
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Re: BUZZ BOX?

Post by shakyrick »

rbjscott wrote:If I am turning the prop very much, I pull the top plugs so the engine won't try to start. Just my way of being safe.
it will fire off the bottom plugs :scratch:

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Re: BUZZ BOX?

Post by Larry »

Not if theres no compression without the the top plugs in.............

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Des Moines Boater
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Re: BUZZ BOX?

Post by Des Moines Boater »

You don't actually turn the ignition on. You un-ground the magnetos to make them hot.

Pull all the top plugs first. Make sure the engine is on the compression stroke, then find TDC. Mark your flywheel. Now back it off 25° and make another mark on the flywheel. Next set the timing mark on the magneto and insert it in the case. Tighten the magneto just enough to be able to turn it. Connect your buzz box by putting one lead on the P-lead of the Left magneto and the other lead to the Right magneto and the black wire to the engine case. Pull the prop through to near or just past TDC and you will hear the impluse snap. Stop after it snaps and rotate the prop backwards to about 30° before top dead center. Now pull it up to 25°. That takes out gear lash. Adjust your magneto with the buzz box to get it to open the points right at 25°. Tighten down the magneto, put the plugs back in and start your engine. Remember you kill the magneto by grounding the P-lead to the engine case. Always treat an engine with a magneto as if the mag is hot.

All this is done on the compression stroke. Be sure the timing for each magneto is actually suppose to be 25°. Don't time it at 25° if it is suppose to be timed at 20°. Be sure the impulse has snapped if you are timing an impulse magneto.

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FL Kracker
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Re: BUZZ BOX?

Post by FL Kracker »

What Des Moines Boater said... :thumbleft:
I even printed it off to give to a friend that always needs my help to time his mags!!! :D


As Des Moines Boater also pointed out.. Always treat an engine with a magneto as if the mag is hot!!!

Don't skip any steps..
Make sure that you back up to at least 30 degrees to remove the gear lash..
Make sure an impulse mag has "snapped"..

My mags have a plug in the side that can be removed to install a "timing tool", which will keep the mag from moving during installation.. If you dont have a "mag timing tool", be very careful when installing a "timed" mag as it can rotate very easily..

Most flywheels have a TDC mark.. However, if the flywheel is not installed correctly, it will not line up with the top case split when the piston is at TDC... I always use a piston stop to find TDC for the first time, then I verify that the TDC mark is correct.. Also, my Lycoming Factory TDC mark was on the "inside" of the flywheel, so I transfered it to the "outside" of the ring gear which makes it easier to line up to the top case split.. (IMO, Never use a hammer and punch to mark the ring gear!! It can loosen the ring gear on the flywheel..) I use a small triangle file to transfer the TDC mark and to make that 25 degree mark on the flywheel.. All you need is a small line.. ( I highlight my marks with my daughter's nail polish..)

Just my two cents...
FK

RidnDirty
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Re: BUZZ BOX?

Post by RidnDirty »

Des Moines Boater wrote:You don't actually turn the ignition on. You un-ground the magnetos to make them hot.

Pull all the top plugs first. Make sure the engine is on the compression stroke, then find TDC. Mark your flywheel. Now back it off 25° and make another mark on the flywheel. Next set the timing mark on the magneto and insert it in the case. Tighten the magneto just enough to be able to turn it. Connect your buzz box by putting one lead on the P-lead of the Left magneto and the other lead to the Right magneto and the black wire to the engine case. Pull the prop through to near or just past TDC and you will hear the impluse snap. Stop after it snaps and rotate the prop backwards to about 30° before top dead center. Now pull it up to 25°. That takes out gear lash. Adjust your magneto with the buzz box to get it to open the points right at 25°. Tighten down the magneto, put the plugs back in and start your engine. Remember you kill the magneto by grounding the P-lead to the engine case. Always treat an engine with a magneto as if the mag is hot.

All this is done on the compression stroke. Be sure the timing for each magneto is actually suppose to be 25°. Don't time it at 25° if it is suppose to be timed at 20°. Be sure the impulse has snapped if you are timing an impulse magneto.
How do you find TDC? After I hear the first mag click?
I dont have a flywheel, I assume to mark the adapter and case to reference the correct position?
Where should I put the ground in order to not kill the mag if not on the case? Cage/alternator bracket?
I have slick mags, the data plate reads LAG. 30. Is that 30 degrees?
What is the easiest protractor to use?

Also when you turn the prop and hear the first click is it suppose to be followed by a second click or are the mags suppose to click once together?

Exuse my ignorance, and much thanks to all. I really enjoy doing stuff and learning on my own. I just dont want to do something wrong and cost more money and this is all foreign to me.

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Des Moines Boater
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Re: BUZZ BOX?

Post by Des Moines Boater »

Take it to someone who knows how to time the magnetos and they will show you. Why do you have 30° magnetos on an engine that should be timed at 20°? Do you know what the timing should be? Take it to someone who knows that engine and they will show you what you need to know.

rbjscott
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Re: BUZZ BOX?

Post by rbjscott »

"30 degeee LAG" is the timing retard built in to the impulse coupling. That engine will time more than 20 degrees, but I don't know Continentals. And yes they should "click" at the same time. Slick mags are easy to install.
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JAMES
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Re: BUZZ BOX?

Post by JAMES »

I WAS TOLD BY 2 OR 3 BUILDERS HERE ON SA SINGLE MAG 30 DEG DUEL 28 DEG IS WHAT TIMING SHOULD BE SET AT ON 6CYL GPUS
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Des Moines Boater
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Re: BUZZ BOX?

Post by Des Moines Boater »

JAMES is quick to give information on every subject, but be careful following any of his advice. Sometimes he is correct but you never know. I would go by the manufactures data sheets when in doubt. They usually know more about their engines than JAMES does. The Type Certificate for the O-520 engines shows the timing should be at 22° BTDC.

There may be a reason to run 30°'s of timing, but I would find out for sure. That could be the wrong magneto for that engine. I'd have it looked at by someone who really knows what they are doing and not someone who just thinks they know everything.

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JAMES
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Re: BUZZ BOX?

Post by JAMES »

Des Moines Boater wrote:JAMES is quick to give information on every subject, but be careful following any of his advice. Sometimes he is correct but you never know. I would go by the manufactures data sheets when in doubt. They usually know more about their engines than JAMES does. The Type Certificate for the O-520 engines shows the timing should be at 22° BTDC.

There may be a reason to run 30°'s of timing, but I would find out for sure. That could be the wrong magneto for that engine. I'd have it looked at by someone who really knows what they are doing and not someone who just thinks they know everything.
I SAID 6CYL GPU CALL SPEED WHEELIE CALL GARY BARBER CALL DANNY OLIVER CALL KENNERS MACHINE SHOP HEARD IT FROM THE BEST GPU IS WHAT I SAID AND THATS THE INFO I GOT FROM THESE GUYS

Des Moines Boater U JUST BECAME A NO IT ALL AFTER INSTALLING THE RONG RINGS IN YOUR MOTOR FROM NOT LISING TO THE PROS REMEMBER THAT :shock: EVERYONE OF US HAS LEARNED SOMETHING SOMEWHERE ON SA ABOUT SOMETHING INCLUDING U
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Des Moines Boater
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Re: BUZZ BOX?

Post by Des Moines Boater »

RONG RINGS , JAMES you are a constant source of entertainment. I know you mean well.

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JAMES
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Re: BUZZ BOX?

Post by JAMES »

Des Moines Boater wrote:RONG RINGS , JAMES you are a constant source of entertainment. I know you mean well.
yea i said u wouldent remember :lol: u did do it though and i cant give u a hard time no more might get in time out again for another 2 weeks guess theirs no such thing as freedom of speech :violent1: :D
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RidnDirty
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Re: BUZZ BOX?

Post by RidnDirty »

Hey guys, much thanks to all inputs. Rbjscott I really appreciated talking to you on the phone. Thanks for the write up on how to Des Moines Boater, I have learned alot from you guys.

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Re: BUZZ BOX?

Post by 220hardin »

Did you get your problem fixed?

RidnDirty
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Re: BUZZ BOX?

Post by RidnDirty »

Seems to be running better. Now I need to replace the plug wires and should be done.

rbjscott
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Re: BUZZ BOX?

Post by rbjscott »

Do you have aircraft or auto wires? What brand mags?
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Re: BUZZ BOX?

Post by Jon stalzer »

just unhook wires from plugs to be safe mag may fire but the power wont get to the plug if its not hooked up.
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