Alaskan hunting Mini

Airboats with smaller powerplants.
Jssflyer
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Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby Jssflyer » Sat Oct 20, 2018 7:40 am

Hello,
Building an enclosed cab, paramotor powered mini for hunting and exploring interior alaska.
Thought I would put a few pics and get peoples props turning. Riveted aluminum hull. 8’x 6’ total dimenions. Expected full weight is 125lbs with engine, fueled, ready to go. As it sits now it’s about 50lbs for the hull and the engine and mount is another 50 lbs. 26hp simonini 2 stroke.
Build philosophy is that I wanted a fully enclosed, heated cab for exploring and hunting in the back country solo. Needs to be small enough for one person to push, pull, load and get unstuck. Ability to haul 50 lbs gear and bring back meat. Must work just as well on snow, ice and water. The vision in my head is “ if G.I. joe had an airboat”
So far, I’m about 150 hrs and 3 weeks into to the build. Set a time frame of 1month to finish this, as if I take any longer, all the water will be frozen for the next 7 months. I am riveting the top cab together today . Yay, Rivets ! Waiting on the vinyl wrap and bottom protection to get here...shipping to Alaska sucks ! Cost more than the product to get it here.
Here’s a few pics, and will be uploading more as the build and trials come along. Thanks to everyone on this site, there is a lot of information and pics to learn from. Happy Sliding !]

Update for Monday. Got the Hull Riveted to the frame and sealed. Then got the entire bottom hull, chines, and seat pan riveted up and sealed. Got to get into the seat and make motor sounds ! Clecod in the walk way , hull doubters.and removed the hull from the stands and put on floor. Wow, it’s small. Maybe a Micro Airboat? Hoping the vinyl wrap shows up today...more to come in a few days.

Update . Sunday 10/27/18. The build progresses. Mainly doing finishing work at this point. Final mounting of engine, wiring, linkages, etc..still paint and wrap to go. Expect to have it outside in 3-4 days for initial runs. Will be heavier than wanted..of course. But I still think it will be under 150 lbs total, all up. The windows are heavier than expected. So far, I’m very happy with the overall strength, rigidity and usability of the design. We will find out in a few days if it works....
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Last edited by Jssflyer on Sun Oct 28, 2018 1:12 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Mossy Cypress
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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby Mossy Cypress » Sat Oct 20, 2018 2:00 pm

Looks great! I hope it performs like you are wanting. What a great idea to get into the smaller more remote places. I find myself going solo a lot also, looks like it's going to comfy and a blast. I will be watching this build closely. Great job! Some of your guys skills amaze me.

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kwanjangnihm
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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby kwanjangnihm » Sat Oct 20, 2018 2:28 pm

Welcome to SA! :salute:

Very cool looking build. Props need clean air for thrust and that cab blocks a high percentage. (food for thought)

Good luck and keep the photos coming. :thumbleft:
" I don't care who you are back in the world, you give away our position one more time, I'll bleed ya, real quiet. Leave ya here. Got that? "

Jssflyer
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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby Jssflyer » Sun Oct 21, 2018 12:45 pm

Hi, thanks for the feedback. The cab will have built in ducting to increase airflow to the prop, and direct cooling to the engine head. ( not built in yet, will post pics)The engine mount is designed to keep the prop 18” off the back of the paramotor pilot, which is normally sitting right in front with full flying gear and arms spread out holding the lines. A large wind block in any case. I hope to have more thrust and clean air than I previously had just using it as a paramotor....testing to come.

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Slidin Gator
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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby Slidin Gator » Sun Oct 21, 2018 2:13 pm

Jssflyer,

That’s a cool project you have and you sure appear to know what you are doing, nice work. But I think you are holding back on us. Once you get to the way back I think you are gonna pull the motor off and go flying. :fishing

Put 2 of the motors on and just make the whole rig fly!

Can you escape the cab easily if you sink it?
I grew up thinking I-10 was the Mason Dixon line.
1986 Airboat Engineering Inc., 14' Marsh Master. Refreshed narrow deck, SV O-540, 72” NGQ. A Bob Stossel original.

Jssflyer
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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby Jssflyer » Sun Oct 21, 2018 3:49 pm

Hi Slidin Gator,
Thanks, I do “Appear “to know what I’m doing....fake it till you make it !
Yes, any water pressure at all would blow in the lexan windows and the entire front Door opens outward and up to leave the craft instantly if needed ( more for the ability to grab the rifle, and stand up instantly for shooting position, but it serves several purposes , also allows for open door operation when its not too cold.
And Yes, I plan on using the paramotor as a separate unit, including a built in storage above the seat to keep the wing ,any gear dry, safe and out of the bottom of a wet boat....otherwise I wouldn’t have used a $6k engine.. this being the prototype I am hard bolting to the hull to play with torque, pitch, flow, planing, etc. that will be version 2.0.
Thanks for spilling the beans!

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Slidin Gator
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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby Slidin Gator » Sun Oct 21, 2018 6:22 pm

The whole project makes perfect sense for sure. What a way to scout!

Jssflyer wrote:this being the prototype I am hard bolting to the hull to play with torque, pitch, flow, planing, etc. that will be version 2.0.


What do you mean by hard bolting? Do you intend to use a rudder on version 1.0 or steer the whole rig? What about pitch adjustment?
I grew up thinking I-10 was the Mason Dixon line.
1986 Airboat Engineering Inc., 14' Marsh Master. Refreshed narrow deck, SV O-540, 72” NGQ. A Bob Stossel original.

bkmail
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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby bkmail » Mon Oct 22, 2018 3:36 am

I don't think your hull is deep enough of wide enough. With it being so light the hull cannot be very thick.
Correct me if I'm wrong, just looking at your pics.
Where do you plan to run this boat? Location in the state matters.
What bottom protection are you using?
Bk
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502 BBC on a 18' Alumitech 2.68 Stinger box, w/84" 4 blade Whisper Tip Whirlwind blades.

Jssflyer
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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby Jssflyer » Mon Oct 22, 2018 6:50 am

Morning Gator and bkmail,
Yes, there will be a rudder and I will be hard mountining the engine to the firewall so that I can get my thrustline, torque correction and prop right, without the variables of a quick release system. One thing at a time..
Bkmail, thanks for your comments. Hull thickness is .040, not thick enough for large boats, but mine doesn’t weigh 1000 lbs or have 300 hp pushing it . The entire craft will probably weigh less than most boats fuel load. my hull is not probably wide or deep enough for most hardcore airboaters. It is 12” deep and 4 ft wide. I see a lot of mini boats that work pretty good with 15 hp Honda’s on the back with those measurements, a couple of local ones, as well. I’m in interior alaska and will be using this in tiny sloughs, streams and rivers up in the interior. No hardcore climbing rivers or rock hopping, just going up very thin and shallow gravel rivers. I’m tired, and my friends of constantly having to rebuild, re-shim and replace jet impellers on the way to the hunting grounds. Bottom protection is a testing platform for me. I will be using a new vinyl armor that is used in other industries, and will post some vids of how that works out. Thanks for your interest. Will be finishing this up this week, and posting vids , pics and results...good or bad.

Jssflyer
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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby Jssflyer » Mon Oct 22, 2018 7:23 am

Hi bkmail, wow...after looking at your website, I understand your reservations. Those are beautiful boats you have ! If I’m ever down that way, would love to come see em. Nice to meet you.

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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby bkmail » Mon Oct 22, 2018 12:49 pm

Look forward to more pics and info.
Interior has a muddy/swampy typesetting vs out rocky/boulder laden streams of South central.
Love to meet you anytime your down this way.

Have you met Skip Olsen in Fbx yet?
Keep up the good work!
Bk
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502 BBC on a 18' Alumitech 2.68 Stinger box, w/84" 4 blade Whisper Tip Whirlwind blades.

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Scotty1
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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby Scotty1 » Mon Oct 29, 2018 6:51 am

:rebel: Wow what happened here gets you all interested then stops posting, would like to see more posts :rebel:

Jssflyer
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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby Jssflyer » Mon Oct 29, 2018 7:01 am

Have been updating in the original post and adding pics

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kwanjangnihm
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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby kwanjangnihm » Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:30 am

bottom is very narrow :scratch:

if it were to flip forward, that b*tch is gonna trap you inside! :violent1:

other than that looking forward to see how it performs! :thumbleft:
" I don't care who you are back in the world, you give away our position one more time, I'll bleed ya, real quiet. Leave ya here. Got that? "

Jssflyer
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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby Jssflyer » Mon Oct 29, 2018 10:04 am

Not as narrow as your mind...it’s 4 ft wide at the rear and that’s the norm for MINI boats.
If, coulda, woulda, possibly...blah, blah, blah. Helicopters, airplanes,cars and carnival rides all have the same problem when crashed. Still use all of those.
I’m still waiting to see how it does too.
Mainly it’s small because of the sloughs (which is what Floridians call a canal) are only 4 to 6ft wide at points and I need a small boat to get way out of the crowded hunting here. It’s ridiculous to try to hunt around here. Hundreds of other people in a few square miles right off the road or main river.
More updates to come. Mounting the engine today...and it finally snowed , so I have a few inches of powder to try it out on.

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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby bob_esper » Mon Oct 29, 2018 10:21 am

where is the original post?
2017 18.5/8 Alumitech
408 LS
2.38 stinger with 79" 3 blade ex

Jssflyer
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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby Jssflyer » Mon Oct 29, 2018 3:17 pm

Hi bob, at the top of this thread is the original post, and I have just been adding pics and small update paragraphs as I go. Thanks for the interest. I will be putting vids on tube or a dedicated website soon.

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Slidin Gator
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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby Slidin Gator » Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:37 pm

Jssflyer wrote:Have been updating in the original post and adding pics

Jss,
For future reference, just make a new post with new updates. When you make a new post to the thread it pops back up to the top of the main screen where everyone will see that there is something new. When you edit an old post, it gets buried and no one sees your updates. Just a quirk of the site.

I'm with Kwan on the potential for getting trapped, I'd suggest leaving the front windshield off for your initial trials. If it was me, I'd want vinyl on the front, something I can kick open no matter which way it is laying. Include a pony scuba bottle and wetsuit for first runs!

Weight balance does seem to be on the nose, I originally imagined the whole paramotor hanging off the back and pivoting the whole rig for steering. I think that is your plan for V. 2.0?? Moving that motor aft will help with weight balance, I think you have plenty to spare.

Like the others, I am waiting for some trials video, always cool to see someone trying something new.
I grew up thinking I-10 was the Mason Dixon line.
1986 Airboat Engineering Inc., 14' Marsh Master. Refreshed narrow deck, SV O-540, 72” NGQ. A Bob Stossel original.

Jssflyer
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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby Jssflyer » Mon Oct 29, 2018 9:20 pm

Update for Tuesday. 10/28/2018
Thanks for the heads up slidin gator. I don’t do forums very often, forgive my ignorance.
So, today was a long day, bout 10 hours on filling in the cage and then moved into ducting for better airflow. Tedious work, but really like the way it looks, fits and strengthens the firewall.
Here’s a few pics of today’s work with the ducting, one of the rear rudder details and transom, chine angles etc. bottom width is 4 ft, and 5’8” overall width at the rear with the chines.
Weight and balance.... I set it up so my core weight is at 60-65% of hull length. The firewall and engine; fuel , prop, cage, battery and rudder are all Past 70% to 100% hull length. The only thing forward of 50% is my knees and feet and the front door. Also, to keep the weight down and help encourage more precise steering the front nose is only 2feet wide. I did make it the thickest materials all the way around for crush protection, but all in all it’s really light up there.
If y’all really see that as off, I will be xtra careful while testing. First tests on snow, and none of the water I will be in is deeper than a few inches. So no scuba needed. Lol. Thanks for the heads up.
What is the ideal weight ratio to length for a planing boat?
Almost all of the structural work on the boat is done, sealed and riveted. Will take a couple days to finish up interior work, thorough cleaning, priming,painting etc. as soon as the bottom protection shows up, ( any day )will be cutting a large hole in the wall of the shop and get this bad boy outside.
Apologies for the condition of the shop..been building hard and haven’t cleaned in while.
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Jssflyer
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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby Jssflyer » Tue Oct 30, 2018 12:45 am

Hi slidin gator, after a couple hours and a few beers I’m starting to see this balance issue. Which I won’t be able to see at all tomorrow morning !
So... one thing I had not not accounted for is the front rake of the bow when I thought..oh, my center of balance Is 65% , 70% of hull length is that because of the rake the first 3’ never touches the water or provides buoyancy. So, my 65-70% is more like 15%
In full disclosure I designed this boat to be more of a “carver” than a slider. The small canals and sloughs I need to navigate have steep sides and lots of trees and branches on the outside curve. I need to be able to lean into and carve through the turn more than slide. Hence the the thin and weight adjustable hull in the front.

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Scotty1
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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby Scotty1 » Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:04 am

:rebel: Where you planning on putting all your meat from the hunts are you bringing a sled or something to haul it back. Looks cool hope it works out for you. :rebel:

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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby Jssflyer » Tue Oct 30, 2018 11:17 am

Hi y’all, could use a little help on thrust line and torque correction. I’m used to airplanes using 1.5/2 degrees down and right to offset for thrust acceleration and torque correction.my question is do I set the thrustline parallel to the hull? And just a degree or two right for torque? Or is a bit up or down on the thrust help with planing? Understand every boat is different..but Is there a roule of thumb??

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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby Jssflyer » Tue Oct 30, 2018 11:54 am

Hi Scotty, I will go back home, and get into the zenith 701 Bush plane and go get the meat that way.

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Slidin Gator
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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby Slidin Gator » Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:35 pm

Jssflyer wrote:Hi Scotty, I will go back home, and get into the zenith 701 Bush plane and go get the meat that way.

That ought to work :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

I keep trying to figure out the best way to put a trap door through your hull, cause if I was flying around in that boat, I would want a way to shoot down.

Jssflyer wrote:Hi y’all, could use a little help on thrust line and torque correction. I’m used to airplanes using 1.5/2 degrees down and right to offset for thrust acceleration and torque correction.my question is do I set the thrustline parallel to the hull? And just a degree or two right for torque? Or is a bit up or down on the thrust help with planing? Understand every boat is different..but Is there a roule of thumb??


In general, the prop shaft runs parallel with the hull center line and adjustable angled up/down. Some have played with a bit of parallel offset angle to counteract torque, more often than not, that is for racing purposes. Generally speaking, the port or stbd (depending on prop rotation) front corner of the boat will dip down under acceleration, once on a plane the rudder counteracts. I have a trim tab on the rudder to tweak to make the rudder run neutral. Like any boat with a single prop, they tend to handle a bit differently from Port to Stbd turning.

For your application, the narrow front of the hull will amplify the torque roll and may require some unique solutions. :scratch:

Angling the prop up down has the exact same effect as it does on a kicker boat. You need to provide a means to adjust this. We normally do this by shimming the motor mounts. Again, with the narrow front I suspect you are going to need some up angle (prop shaft angled up towards aft) to hold the nose up.

Most big airboat hulls have the widest flat section at the bow to lift during acceleration and clear a path for the rest of the boat, but your needs may be different.

Before you get much further, bust a hole in that shop and find a place to float test what you have right now. Leave the high dollar paramotor at home, just distribute lead/concrete/scrap steel weight as expected and go see how she floats. Get a torque wrench and apply the torque your motor makes to the hull. That will tell you more than anything about how to finish the outfitting.

This link and others on this site covers hull design concepts in more depth.
https://southernairboat.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=57&t=71662#p689806
I grew up thinking I-10 was the Mason Dixon line.
1986 Airboat Engineering Inc., 14' Marsh Master. Refreshed narrow deck, SV O-540, 72” NGQ. A Bob Stossel original.

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AlaskanOutdoorsman
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Re: Alaskan hunting Mini

Postby AlaskanOutdoorsman » Tue Oct 30, 2018 6:05 pm

Interesting design; we don't see to many airboats in Alaska under 65hp.


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