Caddy Engine (500), Recommended Hull Size-DD?

Rollbar1 · Post by **Rollbar1** » Fri Apr 22, 2016 12:29 pm

What is the recommended hull size for running this engine/HP on a DD setup?
New to A-Boating and I thinking of building one.
My original thought was to go with a small engine (Rotax setup etc) on a 12'x7'6" hull, but if I go to a Caddy setup I'm sure I would have to go bigger, but I really don't know. Still checking my options before I make a final decision.

Thanks for the help,
Jim

P.S. The Caddy motor in reference belongs to a friend who is selling a Caddy 500 he pulled many moons ago to put in a RatRod, complete engine with tranny/everything there and he has done nothing with it at all/sitting in his garage. I'll find out more tonight how much he really wants, but I heard he maybe asking $500.00 for the entire setup. I know noting about the Caddy engine except for what I have read on here regarding DD applications etc. Also, I no nothing about the tranny or how much I can sell that for/don't need it? Any thoughts on that and recouping some money off of the tranny? Seems like a good deal for the price etc.

Edit to show the info I just found that this is a 425cu, not a 500. Also, with the 425cu the hull size might need to be smaller???

scottyroll · Post by **scottyroll** » Fri Apr 22, 2016 12:31 pm

How many people are you hauling?

Rollbar1 · Post by **Rollbar1** » Fri Apr 22, 2016 12:35 pm

scottyroll wrote:How many people are you hauling?

Two-Wife and I 90% of the time.

BluByU2 · Post by **BluByU2** » Fri Apr 22, 2016 12:44 pm

Regarding your specific question regarding hull size; I have found that for a DD application, 13'6" to 15' is a good range in length. The width depends on the brand of hull, example is a Rivermaster is 7'4", the Jimmy White is 8'3", and the Predator is 7'9". The longest hull I have personally run is the 15' Cottonmouth.

You may want to check with your friend to see what he may have done to the engine, such as new timing set, cam, ignition, etc. Keep your metal work light, and limit your passengers to no more than 4 average size adults if you plan on running dry ground.

If you have any questions about the Cadillac engine, or you are needing a rebuild, you may want to speak with Buddy Branch, (352) 797-9910.

scottyroll · Post by **scottyroll** » Fri Apr 22, 2016 1:22 pm

I agree with Blu in regards to hull length. I personally would choose a 14ft x 7'-8ft' and keep it light.

Rollbar1 · Post by **Rollbar1** » Fri Apr 22, 2016 1:43 pm

Thank you all.

SCORE

-Just got off the phone and bought the Motor combo/$300.00

Still has A/C compressor etc. on it and he will even run the engine before I buy.

I think it's stock

but at any rate, I'll take it and talk to him later about that.
Great deal I think and I like the 14'x8' hull recommendation.

Now, I was thinking 18" sides or should I go 20"

Thanks again and for the Caddy engine phone number link.

Jim

SWAMPHUNTER45 · Post by **SWAMPHUNTER45** » Fri Apr 22, 2016 2:20 pm

Blu had a 13 plus Jimmy White and it was probably the best all around Caddy DD hull that I have seen.
A little flimsy compared to the Rivermaster or Predator but it sure worked.

Would run 55mph with 3 people in it and never had trouble breaking free on the grass.

Rollbar1 · Post by **Rollbar1** » Fri Apr 22, 2016 3:05 pm

Thank you. I'll check out the Jimmy White.

pontoon outlaw · Post by **pontoon outlaw** » Fri Apr 22, 2016 7:24 pm

I have a 12 ft charley jones hull under my Caddy 507 with a gearbox

but, I ran DD with same Hull for many years and it runs the Hill like a scalded dog

and we all know it doesn't matter what size Hull you run they all find the bottom of the River some time or another!!!!! They been telling me for 12 years that Hull is to small and If I get a 14 ft it will run a lot better

Rollbar1 · Post by **Rollbar1** » Fri Apr 22, 2016 7:46 pm

Thank you, I'll check it out.

Rollbar1 · Post by **Rollbar1** » Fri Apr 22, 2016 7:47 pm

I did read somewhere that it was at least recommended to change out the rockers or rocker assy? But maybe I should make or find that other post if I can.

Thanks again everyone,
Jim

Deano · Post by **Deano** » Fri Apr 22, 2016 8:23 pm

The need for a shaft rocker system arises when you progress beyond DD RPMS (3000+/) and go on to running a gearbox at higher RPMs. IMO, it is simply not necessary at direct drive rpms. That money could be much better spent elsewhere when your intent is to run direct drive.

What should be considered mandatory though is a Cloyes Timing set, I believe it's #91-139.
The OEM timing gear had composite teeth, some of which may have ended up in the pan by now.

I also strongly recommend dropping the oil pan and removing whatever timing gear bits and/or broken valve seals that there may be. Additionally, while you are there be sure the pickup is also cleaned of such crap. It tends to suck that stuff up and it can and will get lodged between the screen and the cover.

SWAMPHUNTER45 · Post by **SWAMPHUNTER45** » Fri Apr 22, 2016 9:49 pm

Deano it appears that you both are local, maybe you can take a look at his salvage engine and tell him what he has to start with.

If it is a good clean take out you have offered up some excellent advice.

Rollbar1 · Post by **Rollbar1** » Fri Apr 22, 2016 9:54 pm

Deano wrote:The need for a shaft rocker system arises when you progress beyond DD RPMS (3000+/) and go on to running a gearbox at higher RPMs. IMO, it is simply not necessary at direct drive rpms. That money could be much better spent elsewhere when your intent is to run direct drive.

What should be considered mandatory though is a Cloyes Timing set, I believe it's #91-139.
The OEM timing gear had composite teeth, some of which may have ended up in the pan by now.

I also strongly recommend dropping the oil pan and removing whatever timing gear bits and/or broken valve seals that there may be. Additionally, while you are there be sure the pickup is also cleaned of such crap. It tends to suck that stuff up and it can and will get lodged between the screen and the cover.

Ok thank you very much for the information and P/N.

I'll check these things out.

Deano · Post by **Deano** » Sat Apr 23, 2016 7:23 pm

SWAMPHUNTER45 wrote:Deano it appears that you both are local . . . .

I can see, said the blind man.

PM sent

jeepinocala1111 · Post by **jeepinocala1111** » Sat Apr 23, 2016 8:07 pm

Rollbar1 wrote:Thank you. I'll check out the Jimmy White.

Jimmy White built my hull and I love it. I am having him build me a second hull very soon. His 8ft wide hull is a great hull from what I have seen my current hul for fishing/hunting is his 7'4" wide x 13' and it rides great.

Rollbar1 · Post by **Rollbar1** » Sat Apr 23, 2016 8:56 pm

jeepinocala1111 wrote:
Rollbar1 wrote:Thank you. I'll check out the Jimmy White.
Jimmy White built my hull and I love it. I am having him build me a second hull very soon. His 8ft wide hull is a great hull from what I have seen my current hul for fishing/hunting is his 7'4" wide x 13' and it rides great.

Sounds like a good setup.

I to like to fish/hunt/camp etc. Pics?

Question, when you run a fiberglass hull, do you have to run with poly to run dry?

So far I'm looking to only run dry if needed to cross something. That is why I was giving up on the mini/Rotax/Vw setup since it would eliminate me from 2/3rds or of places to go.

Rollbar1 · Post by **Rollbar1** » Sat Apr 23, 2016 8:58 pm

Deano wrote:
SWAMPHUNTER45 wrote:Deano it appears that you both are local . . . .
I can see, said the blind man.

PM sent

Replied-Thank you.

jeepinocala1111 · Post by **jeepinocala1111** » Sat Apr 23, 2016 9:12 pm

Rollbar1 wrote:
jeepinocala1111 wrote:
Rollbar1 wrote:Thank you. I'll check out the Jimmy White.
Jimmy White built my hull and I love it. I am having him build me a second hull very soon. His 8ft wide hull is a great hull from what I have seen my current hul for fishing/hunting is his 7'4" wide x 13' and it rides great.
Sounds like a good setup.

I to like to fish/hunt/camp etc. Pics?

Question, when you run a fiberglass hull, do you have to run with poly to run dry?

So far I'm looking to only run dry if needed to cross something. That is why I was giving up on the mini/Rotax/Vw setup since it would eliminate me from 2/3rds or of places to go.

Jimmy put Quickslick on the bottom of my hull.

Rollbar1 · Post by **Rollbar1** » Sat Apr 23, 2016 9:47 pm

Thank you very much ^^^.

Rollbar1 · Post by **Rollbar1** » Sun Apr 24, 2016 4:19 pm

I have been reading a lot on the Caddy motor and this might be something to do along with checking the end-play but I would have to leave that to the professionals I guess.

http://www.southernairboat.com/phpBB3/v ... 26&start=0

Excerpt from waterthunders post:

What this does is guide pressurized oil from the bearing and directs it to the thrust face surface of the thrust bearing it's simple and effective. You take both bearing shells and with a small jewelers file you file a 45 degree chamfer on both sides of the parting line on both bearings when you hold them together you can see how oil is now flowing to the thrust face. Here is a pic of what you need to do.

scottyroll · Post by **scottyroll** » Sun Apr 24, 2016 4:45 pm

pontoon outlaw wrote: They been telling me for 12 years that Hull is to small and If I get a 14 ft it will run a lot better

I guess you will try your best to never know the difference

jimbo_jwc · Post by **jimbo_jwc** » Sun Apr 24, 2016 9:53 pm

I like my 15x8 Rivermaster 4 seater 500 caddie and always seem to find more to carry each outing and where I boat they will find me from the debris field if it sinks .Floatation is going in bottom made from ISO board insulation to the height of the stringers . Some pics on here .

Gary S · Post by **Gary S** » Mon Apr 25, 2016 6:47 am

I don't know what iso board is but make sure whatever you use is closed cell.
If it's not it will absorb water.

Rollbar1 · Post by **Rollbar1** » Mon Apr 25, 2016 3:20 pm

Well I stopped by the person with the motor and we found the plate off the radiator.
The motor is a 1978, 425 cu not 500.
Any good?
It should be ok for what I need. I know nothing about Caddy motors.

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