I'm Building 2 Stossel Boats with High Torque Motors

A general, non-powerplant specific, discussion on airboat technology, ie., hulls, rigging, polymer, etc..
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Slidin Gator
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Re: I'm Building 2 Stossel Boats with High Torque Motors

Post by Slidin Gator »

Hull was well prepped. It’s from flexing at the seam, the crack line seen in the pics runs most the length of the bottom, right along the seam. The hull has seen some flex and has definitely freed up off the nose.
I still think I-10 is the Mason Dixon line.
2013 Mike Stossel Boats, 13' x 7' deck over, IO-540, 74" NGQ less winglets.

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hogdoggin
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Re: I'm Building 2 Stossel Boats with High Torque Motors

Post by hogdoggin »

I've never heard of any paint on bottom lasting on a true hunt boat. Running over myrtles and switch grass is going bust it up and wear it off as fast as you can paint it on. I know you know this. But I laugh when I go down to Kissimmee and these guys in the marsh with their fiberglass hulls you can't even think about stepping on the side cause they are laid up so thin the damn side would snap off. With their slick bottom talking about how badass their hunt boats are. Maybe they are hunting snipe running around in a grass field. 😁

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Re: I'm Building 2 Stossel Boats with High Torque Motors

Post by Seven3 »

Every riveted hull I have ever owned has lost some steelflex at the seams. And all of my boats have been built by the best of the best. Perfectly normal.

Rich Andrews
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Re: I'm Building 2 Stossel Boats with High Torque Motors

Post by Rich Andrews »

Hunting snipe around a grass field LOL, ...knowing a little about 2 part epoxys one would think the manufacturer would be able to add some elongation properties to the product id asked for?

I've been working on a proprietary formula a few yrs now on and off but I do know it exists.

Here's some reading https://www.epoxyworks.com/index.php/un ... roperties/
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Deano
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Re: I'm Building 2 Stossel Boats with High Torque Motors

Post by Deano »

Rich Andrews wrote: ...knowing a little about 2 part epoxys one would think the manufacturer would be able to add some elongation properties to the product id asked for?
Ah, come on Rich, ya ain't being fair. :wink:
That article doesn't address Hardness, a required attribute for decreased wear and longevity of a bottom coating.

Even with today's comparatively advanced technology, nearly everything is still a trade off.
Don't the Elongation and Hardness parameters STILL maintain a certain measure/amount of mutual exclusivity?
Not to mention that Adhesion is another required parameter potentially complicated by the desired tilt of that trade off.

I don't necessarily disagree with your assessment; my take away is simply different than yours.
It just appears to me that the Marketing Department came first, and then Research & Development.
After all, they did opt to name it "SteelFLEX". :lol:

Which all combines to forming my (useless to anybody else) preference for polymer over dealing with bottom maintenance. :dontknow:
*Standard Disclaimer: I don't spend a bunch of my time racing, chasing hogs two miles from the water, etc. YRMV
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Re: I'm Building 2 Stossel Boats with High Torque Motors

Post by Rich Andrews »

I'd like to run a steel flex experiment on a rivet boat and apply the material on a hot metal surface in white. Then run a second application on the same boat in black under normal circumstances. Believe it or not heat will activate more of the chemical compounds in some instances which give a better adhesion and hardness result.

I've seen a very hard 2 part product flex as much as 12 inches and not break or loose its original dimensions. I have a sample i've wire brushed hammered with the claw end of a 2 lb hammer and you can barely see anything has happened. We have ZERO problems with adhesion on Steel aluminum has been the challenge but if I had some extra $$ im sure we are very close to an alternative to poly and steel flex.
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Re: I'm Building 2 Stossel Boats with High Torque Motors

Post by Rich Andrews »

One other thing learned was some rivets are not equal... and steel flex will not bond properly to them without a neutral primer such as a zink chromate and an alodine cleaning the night before. My guess is this is the real problem w airboats and steel flex !

http://www.boeingsuppliers.com/environm ... 003-08.pdf
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Re: I'm Building 2 Stossel Boats with High Torque Motors

Post by Slidin Gator »

Rich Andrews wrote:
Thu Jan 02, 2020 12:19 pm
One other thing learned was some rivets are not equal...
Interesting information Rich, thanks!

There are many ways rivets are not equal. All of the rivets are new, aviation grade, pretty sure 7075, I will get the specs from the builder and details of the surface prep.

What I am seeing is a crack running most the length of the seam, right on the edge of the bottom lap. As I see it, every bump I hit (and I've hit a lot of them, 17.8 hours now) flexes the whole bottom up and down, exactly as it should. This causes the outer edge of the lap (extending past the rivets) to flex out and in, shearing the paint.

I need to look at the missing patches a bit more. I think they were initiated by the crack, but there could be an adhesion issue. I will be doing that real soon since I'm heading to the paint store in the AM to get more steel flex. It looks like I'm getting a can each of zinc chromate and alodine.:thumbleft:

Don't have time for the white vs. black experiment, patch and go time. :cheers:
I still think I-10 is the Mason Dixon line.
2013 Mike Stossel Boats, 13' x 7' deck over, IO-540, 74" NGQ less winglets.

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Re: I'm Building 2 Stossel Boats with High Torque Motors

Post by Slidin Gator »

Heading back to the launch through sticky afternoon Maidencane. Steelflex 2000 outruns polymer hands down in the sticky green.




But like booze and women, there is a downside, 19 hours of Maidencane and sand is rough on Steelflex :violent1: I don't think better prep is going to extend the life much, it looks like the repaint interval is going to be shorter than the oil change interval :banghead:

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Guess my son didn't see the bottle of white tint, he just found the black. It looks like he will have more opportunity to get the color match right. All the fresh bare metal was alodine and chromate treated for good measure.

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I still think I-10 is the Mason Dixon line.
2013 Mike Stossel Boats, 13' x 7' deck over, IO-540, 74" NGQ less winglets.

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Re: I'm Building 2 Stossel Boats with High Torque Motors

Post by Slidin Gator »

Looks like I have had an unfortunate change of plans. I lost one of my best runnin buddies late last year. Up until then my plan was to build Ghost, run a lot of ground and kill a few animals with my buddy Mert. Well, that all changed before we got her done. :(

So I have had some change in plans, the first of the year I bought his hunt boat off the estate. It's a 13 foot deck over, 0.100 riveted 7075 hull, built by Mike Stossel in 2013 in classic Stossel style. Aluminum rigging with a Lycoming IO-540 angle valve running Continental injection, 3/8" polymer and 74" Whisper Tip set on "B" at 16 degrees.

The last build is going to be my son's boat now, that was always the plan (I need a reliable hunt partner), but the timetable just got moved up. The boy can now deal with re-painting the steel flex every week etc. The biggest issue now is the damn boy can't hunt during the week since he has to work all week to buy fuel, plus the shop is getting full! We are also gonna have to come up with a new name for his boat since the deck over is now "Ghost Boat". It's an inside joke, but any issues going forward are going to be blamed on the Ghost of Mert, might as well since I will hear him giving me Shick (in my head) about whatever I am doing wrong at any given moment :slap:

I got one day to run the boat early January (where I took the previous maiden cane video came from) before hitting the road for work. I started the morning by flooding the damn thing and then killing the battery clearing it, Mert was pissed. :violent1: Pulled a truck battery and headed out (just didn't shut down again all day...). Since then it's been ordering parts from random hotels and sending my son boat to do lists.

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I still think I-10 is the Mason Dixon line.
2013 Mike Stossel Boats, 13' x 7' deck over, IO-540, 74" NGQ less winglets.

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kwanjangnihm
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Re: I'm Building 2 Stossel Boats with High Torque Motors

Post by kwanjangnihm »

SG - sorry to hear about your compadre Mert, but what a great way for his legacy to slide on!! :salute: :cheers:

Is that a fab'd air filter on the fuel injection intake?
He'll cut your throat, baby, stick you in the back, drive off in your Cadillac.
He's more trouble than you think, he'll kill your sugar, leave you in the drink.

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Re: I'm Building 2 Stossel Boats with High Torque Motors

Post by CarMotorBarge »

That was very unfortunate what happened to Mert. Mike took me for a ride on the maiden voyage of Mert's boat in Gopher Slough. It was a nice running boat. 8)
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Re: I'm Building 2 Stossel Boats with High Torque Motors

Post by Slidin Gator »

kwanjangnihm wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 5:08 am
SG - sorry to hear about your compadre Mert, but what a great way for his legacy to slide on!! :salute: :cheers:

Is that a fab'd air filter on the fuel injection intake?
Yes, it's a fabricated box with a screen vs. an actual filter, you can really call it a flame arrestor. Mert never liked running an air filter, he wanted the motor to get all the air it could! The problem is that the servo intake is directly in line with a rail on the rigging and the air is choked down making a sharp 90 degree turn into the intake. I plan to modify this by adding an elbow to point the servo down and switch to a K&N filter.
CarMotorBarge wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 6:03 am
That was very unfortunate what happened to Mert. Mike took me for a ride on the maiden voyage of Mert's boat in Gopher Slough. It was a nice running boat. 8)
Yep, and it still is a great running boat, time to slide on.

Moving on, it looks like Ghost Boat fulfills the 600 ft-lbs, 300 Hp goal specified previously and runs the dry marsh just fine. So I don't think I'm gonna name Ghost Boat #2 like Kwan suggested earlier:
kwanjangnihm wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2019 6:32 am
Slidin Gator wrote: In summary, I have 2 hulls to compare power plants side by side. One may be a AV or a CM and it may or may not have a low ratio gear box on it. One is gonna be high Torque, the other is gonna be higher torque. Time to come up with a name for #2, "Torque Ghost", "TorqueAGator", "MomentArm". Hmm....
its only fitting that if you use a CM engine on your second boat to name it appropriately "#2" :toothy7:
It looks like the old Ugly Duck hull is now #3 (I hope that's not kidney stones, had them :violent1: ) Time to move on and build it! This boat is going to be a CM boat :shock: I have run with some LS powered Palm Beach Hull boats, no doubt they have the power. Fuel mileage wise, we burned about the same, even had to provide AV fuel to a CM boat on one trip. I have no doubt that running skinny water a CM rig will get better fuel economy vs. my AV rigs, but when running ground, power takes fuel.

Time to decide what CM to use and it all comes down to weight vs. torque/power to the prop. Ideally I would like to pull the hemi out of the wife's old car, but that motor is close to 700 lbs with the giant heads, it just won't do.

Although the torque curves are impressive, I have no interest in dealing with a turbo or blown setup, this will be a NA setup.

I looked heavy at the Caddy platform (egged on by Swamp of course). There is a lightweight block option that would come in around 500 lbs and would be my go to option if I was going cast iron. But weight is king, so this is looking like an aluminum LS project, time to join the crowd!

76" is about the limit on the prop diameter, this is a 7 foot wide hull. Power goal is roughly 450 Hp. We have some time to sort out motor and prop, the first goat is to get the hull sorted so we can put polymer on once summer gets cooking.

Stay tuned for updates.
I still think I-10 is the Mason Dixon line.
2013 Mike Stossel Boats, 13' x 7' deck over, IO-540, 74" NGQ less winglets.

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Re: I'm Building 2 Stossel Boats with High Torque Motors

Post by Slidin Gator »

I have had a chance to put some hours on the Mert boat, it put's one hell of a grin on my face, just like it did Mert.

My buddy Mert could kill a deer, but he was huntin hogs all year. I managed to bloody up his boat for him proper last weekend.


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That's a big sow and a big dog on the nose, me and a rider. Nothing but afternoon Sticky to the trailer.

We moved her to the other boat at the ice house.

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I still think I-10 is the Mason Dixon line.
2013 Mike Stossel Boats, 13' x 7' deck over, IO-540, 74" NGQ less winglets.

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Re: I'm Building 2 Stossel Boats with High Torque Motors

Post by Slidin Gator »

This picture was missing, my favorite round.

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I still think I-10 is the Mason Dixon line.
2013 Mike Stossel Boats, 13' x 7' deck over, IO-540, 74" NGQ less winglets.

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Re: I'm Building 2 Stossel Boats with High Torque Motors

Post by hogdoggin »

Glad to see merts boat out in the woods he was a hell of a guy!

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Re: I'm Building 2 Stossel Boats with High Torque Motors

Post by Slidin Gator »

He sure was, we had some adventures and good times over the years. Bloodied it up again today. We were not having any luck, so we used one of Mert’s tactics, stop for a beer.

We cut the dogs loose and hung out, pretty soon the tracker said “Roscoe is Barking.” Game on.

The boat runs awesome, wish he was still running it.
I still think I-10 is the Mason Dixon line.
2013 Mike Stossel Boats, 13' x 7' deck over, IO-540, 74" NGQ less winglets.

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