Coastal Bays Workshop Final Report Needs to be Rewritten!

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CaptSteve
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Coastal Bays Workshop Final Report Needs to be Rewritten!

Post by CaptSteve » Mon Feb 21, 2011 8:02 pm

As it happens, one of my duck-hunter clients, Dave Ankney, heard about the WWP's proposal to close areas to motorized boat traffic and asked me about it and to keep him informed about how the issue developed. I did that including sending him a copy of the survey and the Draft Report from the Workshop as well as the various comments on the Draft that I'd sent to Dr. McKinney. I've now sent him the Final Report and asked for his comments, which I've pasted in below with his permission ( Note that Dave is a Professor Emeritus of Biology who taught wildlife management and did extensive wildlife research: http://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=c+d ... as_sdtp=on)

Dear Steve,

Thanks for sending me a copy of the Report written by Dr. McKinney. I note that due to your efforts, he's no longer claiming that the workshop participants are a "true cross-section" of bay users, but he still insists that the participants were "reflective of users as a whole", which is unknown at best and wildly wrong at worst ( 35% of workshop participants access the bays via wading or kayaking and my "lying eyes" tell me that's FAR higher than the actual percent who access the bays in that fashion especially given that a motorized craft may hold 4 or more people whereas a kayak or wader represents one person only). It's most important that the TPWD Commission be made aware that this Report is based on nothing more than a straw poll of a non-random sample of bay users and the conclusions should be treated accordingly; a different sample of users asked the same questions, but with a different set of answers to choose from might very well produce very different results.

Dr. McKinney also got one of the most crucial parts of the results wrong, i.e., the part about a demonstration pole and troll zone to test and evaluate the effectiveness of such a concept in reducing impacts and conflicts, improving fishing opportunities, and to evaluate the concept's acceptance by the angling community? From p.10 of the Report ( my emphasis and my comments in brackets ):--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

41.7% of workshop participants filling out the survey [Wrong -- see below ] felt TPWD should implement it on a test case basis subject to sunset review to gauge its effectiveness in dealing with user conflict issues and possibly to improve fishing. 19.4% of all workshop participants felt TPWD should study the effectiveness of this strategy in other areas to determine its relevance and potential effectiveness in dealing with conflict issues and possibly improve fishing. A case could be made that the 19.4% supporting further study were not necessarily supportive of a test area or areas, just additional investigation. On the other hand, such investigations can include test or experimental areas (discussed in the workshop) an interpretation of support for some level of experimentation. [ No! Those 19.4% were voting for study of the effectiveness IN OTHER AREAS ] Regardless, general support for some level of similar experimental or test area would appear to range from a minimum of 42% up to a maximum of 61%, most likely somewhere in between. [ That is patently incorrect! The minimum is 36.6% and it's also the maximum because NONE of the other questions included "experimental or test areas"] Some 25% of participants responding to the survey claerly felt this strategy should not be pursued.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As you clearly pointed out to him in your comments on the Draft Report, it was 41.7% of those who answered the question, not of those who filled out the survey ( it's only 36.6% of those who filled out the survey )! As he well knows, 10 of 82 who filled out the survey didn't answer that question. He's also put a big spin on the 19.4% who said that it should be studied in other areas -- that would not lead to "test or experimental areas" in this area -- any reasonable person would conclude that the answer meant surveying agencies where such areas are in place to determine their effectiveness. I now can't help but conclude that he's skewed the interpretation in favor of WWP. The old saying goes "Never attribute to malice that which can be explained by stupidity" -- I don't think that stupidity caused this misinterpretation of the data especially after you spent so much time showing him what an unbiased interpretation of these data looks like!

Interestingly, 35% of the attendees access the bays via wading or kayak and he found that 37% want areas closed to power boats. Coincidence? I think not!

Best,
DaveA.
"For those who understand, no explanation is needed and for those who do not, none is possible"

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Re: Coastal Bays Workshop Final Report Needs to be Rewritten

Post by rost495 » Mon Feb 21, 2011 10:11 pm

Thats an interesting read for sure!

Great work Steve. Now we have to remember to get all this data to TPW so they see the TRUE issues.

Jeff

I'm still chapped that McKinney's first reply to me was bascially sorry you feel that way but tough, RE the reintroduction of the questions in the survey.
After that I sent at least one other email to him commenting on the time frame for replies.... we had enough time on the survey, but seemed like his edited report was a hurry up and get this thing out of here kind of end run, IMHO.
Doesn't help his case that he has never replied to my comments. Thats really a fair way to run a scheme I guess.

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Re: Coastal Bays Workshop Final Report Needs to be Rewritten

Post by Slayride » Tue Feb 22, 2011 11:31 am

Absolutely no suprise here. I have always said, including to the commissioners, Larry McKinney is NOT the man the TPW places faith in him being! He is in NO way being un bias in this process and should recuse himself from any of this immediately! This process certainly will cause him some character issues.
There is nothing Mystical, Majical or Elusive about quality, we all know what it is!

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Re: Coastal Bays Workshop Final Report Needs to be Rewritten

Post by rost495 » Tue Feb 22, 2011 12:22 pm

As long as we have this form of "evidence" of how it was written vs what the actual polls told us, its just get that info to TPW along with a rewrite so to speak explaining it all, and we can hope that it makes sense to them.

That is no guarantee, but we need to do this, and see what happens.

This is something EVERYONE can involve in. I see folks don't want to drive 6 hours or more one way to pickup up traps or plant grass, and while I would at times, I understand that part. But the coast is the forefront of things to come it seems and writing letters doesn't take that much work really. IF you care about the results.

Personally I'd rather skip one joy ride a year and take the time and money that would be spent there and use it to help keep us keepin on as they say.

Jeff

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Re: Coastal Bays Workshop Final Report Needs to be Rewritten

Post by 80 panther » Tue Feb 22, 2011 5:12 pm

I could not attend the meeting over a comment Imade on face book but they can twist the information to read the way they want it to lol :banghead:

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Re: Coastal Bays Workshop Final Report Needs to be Rewritten

Post by shiggs » Thu Feb 24, 2011 9:08 pm

Sad

If you intentionally skew the results for your agenda, where's your credibility go? The results should speak for themselves...manipulation of those results relegates the whole workshop to nothing but a sham!

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Re: Coastal Bays Workshop Final Report Needs to be Rewritten

Post by MarshRider » Sun Feb 27, 2011 12:20 pm

Marsh Rider carries another story on this issue in the upcoming issue.

I'm happy to continue to carry information about this and the skewed results. It happens in Fl too -- when staff has an agenda
they drive when they can't get "user groups" to support them.


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Re: Coastal Bays Workshop Final Report Needs to be Rewritten

Post by Quackcephus » Sun Feb 27, 2011 3:17 pm

Thanks Bonnie... I called it back when all this "workshop" deal got started & said that these boys were gonna try somethin' like this & tell it the way they wanted it told. :roll:
:texas:

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Re: Coastal Bays Workshop Final Report Needs to be Rewritten

Post by MarshRider » Sun Feb 27, 2011 4:16 pm

let's dissect that report and show what should have come out.
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Re: Coastal Bays Workshop Final Report Needs to be Rewritten

Post by rost495 » Sun Feb 27, 2011 8:00 pm

Quackcephus wrote:Thanks Bonnie... I called it back when all this "workshop" deal got started & said that these boys were gonna try somethin' like this & tell it the way they wanted it told. :roll:
Yeah, but we had folks there, and thats why they won't get away with it like they might have if no one had attended and got the results. I am NOT looking for a pat on the back either, but am saying this is no longer a good ol' boys deal... you are going to have to fight for your rights from now on out unfortunately. Its cost me 2 planned fishing trips and a planned duck trip working against this stuff so far but I refuse to bow down.

The days I was there, and I think that Steve will concur, it seemed like it was not going to be what we thought it would... but the written report shows true colors once again, as do the voting percentages on some of the questions.... they are not looking for safety, all they want is a private playground. Until that attitude grows up on their part and they realize that all have to share the playground its not going to get better.

To have McKinney pimping for them by writing a biased "consensus" report sure does piss a person off though but certainly shows his true bureaucratic color.

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Re: Coastal Bays Workshop Final Report Needs to be Rewritten

Post by MarshRider » Sun Feb 27, 2011 9:10 pm

Jeff:
you're correct...TAA had folks there and you worked as hard as you could for us. It would have
been a complete washout for us if you had not been there. You gained valuable ground and
you and Capt. Steve need to be thanked.
You can help other folks decipher the truth from the "wanna - be -truth" that
is being written.

You are also correct, it's a new day in airboat land. None of us in any state can afford to
sit back and figure it won't happen to us. The unique thing about this relationship and S>A> is
that we get a larger perspective than just our state. We can catch this stuff before it gets so far beyond us we can't
make up lost ground.

THANK YOU!
bonnie
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Re: Coastal Bays Workshop Final Report Needs to be Rewritten

Post by rost495 » Mon Feb 28, 2011 9:37 am

Its not thank me or Steve, and I hope I"m not out of line speaking for Steve... the point here.... we gotta get up and write, show up at meetings, volunteer to help and so on.

I put an email out a while back RE March 5th grass planting again in Rockport... I have had no responses at this time....

Of course when you try to get things rolling its always harder, and we are missing airboaters... ones that run boats but are not TAA folks YET... that has to change.

We have to help each other. We have to get the word out. If you can't or won't volunteer your boat and time for things like grass planting, crab trap cleanup then you need to do your best on letter writing etc.... And I totally understand we have a group thats far away from the coast... thats not an issue, they just have to do their part another way. Same when it comes to an issue on the Red River for example, the rest of the guys way south write letters instead of running way up there for a meeting.

The bottom line though is in the future I"d love to figure out how to make something like a huge grass planting or crab trap work into a big group event, come down, ride on eitehr Friday or Sunday, and do work on Saturday for example.

We can always hope.

Remember folks we have to be professional in this endeavor too.... when you are in the spotlight its not redneck time...

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